Achifanora kushanya kwake kungangoita makumi matatu kuAfghanistan, murwi wemauto Kathy Kelly anokurukura nezve kudiwa kwekunzwira tsitsi nekutsiva.
neNonviolence Radio Chikwata, WNV Metta Center yeNonviolence, Gunyana 29,2021
Yekutanga odhiyo pano: https://wagingnonviolence.org
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Vhiki rino, Michael Nagler naStephanie Van Hook vanotaura naKathy Kelly, anorarama hupenyu husina mhirizhonga, co-muvambi weVoices for Creative Nonviolence uye mubatsiri weBan Killer Drones Campaign. Anokurukura ruzivo rwake rwakakura uye pfungwa nezveAfghanistan. Kupindira kweAmerica, anotenda, kwaive - uye zvirokwazvo, kuchiramba kuri - kurasika zvachose, kuchikwira pane kugadzirisa gakava imomo. Anopa rairo inoshanda uye yakajeka pane zvakanaka nezvinobatika zvine chekuita nekusanganisa, uye inopa nzira dzakananga dzatingaite. Iye anotimanikidzawo kuti tiongororezve edu akafanofungidzirwa mazano, zvese nezve maTaliban isu pachedu; mukuita kudaro isu tinokwanisa kutanga kunzwira tsitsi, kuita zvakare vanhu uye kusanyanya kutya:
Chekutanga pane zvese, ini ndinofunga tinofanirwa kuita izvo iwe naMichael zvawakatsigira muMetta Center kwenguva yakareba. Tinofanira kuwana hushingi hwekudzora kutya kwedu. Tinofanirwa kuve veruzhinji vasina kurohwa zvakanyanya kuti titye boka iri, kutya iro boka, kuti isu ticharamba tichiedza kubhengi kuedza kubvisa boka iri kuti tirege kutya ivo zvakare. Ndicho chinhu chimwe. Ini ndinofunga zvakakosha kuti tirambe tichivaka pfungwa yedu yekudzora kutya kwedu.
Chinhu chechipiri, zvakanyanya kuita, kuziva vanhu vari kutakura mhedzisiro yehondo uye kutama kwedu… Shamwari dzangu diki muAfghanistan dzaive chiratidzo chevanhu vaida kusvika kuvanhu kune rimwe divi redivi. Vakataura nezve nyika isina muganho. Vaida kuve nemapurojekiti emarudzi.
Chete kana isu tichinyatso tarisa kuAfghanistan, patinochiona uye nevanhu vayo mune hupfumi hwavo hwakaoma ndipo patinogona kusvika pakunzwisisa zvirinani kwezvavanoda uye zvavanoda. Chete kuburikidza nekuteerera nekuteerera kune vanhu uye mapoka ari pasi ndipo patinodzidza kuti tingakwanisa sei kujoina navo mukutsvaga nzira dzekugadzirisa kusawirirana nekuvaka zvakare. Uye zvese izvi zvinoenderana nekuzvipira kwakasimba kune kusagadzikana, kuzvininipisa kwechokwadi uye kuzviratidza kwakatendeseka:
… Rusununguko isimba rechokwadi. Tinofanira kutaura chokwadi uye kuzvitarisa pagirazi. Uye izvo zvandangotaura ndizvozvo chaizvo, zvakaoma chaizvo kutarisa. Asi ndinofunga zvinoda kuti unzwisise zvirinani kuti tiri vanaani uye kuti tingataure sei chaizvo, “Tine hurombo. Tine hurombo kwazvo, ”uye ita muripo unoti hatisi kuzoenderera mberi izvi.
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Stephanie: Gamuchirai munhu wese kuNonviolence Radio. Ndini Stephanie Van Hook, uye ndiri pano mu studio neangu wandinoshanda naye uye anchor wenhau, Michael Nagler. Mangwanani akanaka, Michael. Ndatenda nekuve mu studio neni nhasi.
Michael: Mangwanani akanaka, Stephanie. Ndingadai ndisiri imwe nzvimbo mangwanani ano.
Stephanie: Saka, nhasi tine nesu Kathy Kelly. Kune avo venyu vari murunyararo musangano, iye haanyatsoda kuziviswa. Mumwe munhu akatsaurira hupenyu hwake chose pakupedza hondo nemhirizhonga. Ndiye mumwe wenhengo dzekutanga dzeManzwi muRenje, akazozivikanwa sa Voices for Creative Nonviolence, iyo yakavhara mushandirapamwe wayo muna 2020 nekuda kwekuomerwa kuenda munzvimbo dzehondo. Tichanzwa zvimwe pamusoro pazvo. Iye ndiye mubatsiri-murongi we Ban Killer Drones Campaign, uye muratidziri ane World Beyond War.
Tine iye nesu nhasi paNonviolence Radio kutaura nezveAfghanistan. Akave aripo kanoda kusvika makumi matatu nguva. Uye semumwe munhu ari muAmerican akazvipira kupedza hondo, kunzwa nezvezvaakasangana nazvo uye zviri kuitika imomo izvozvi kubva mumaonero ake zvichabatsira zvakanyanya sezvatinoramba tichiwedzera hurukuro dzedu nezveAfghanistan iri munhau nhasi.
Nekudaro, gamuchirai kune Nonviolence Radio, Kathy Kelly.
Kathy: Ndatenda, Stephanie naMichael. Icho chinogara chiri chinhu chinokurudzira kuziva kuti imi vaviri muri kushanda pamwe chete nezvamunoita kukurudzira kusagadzikana uye kuyedza kunzwisisa zvirinani mhedzisiro yehondo dzedu dzehondo.
Michael: Zvakanaka, kuuya kubva kwauri, Kathy, izvo zvinokurudzira kwazvo. Ndatenda.
Stephanie: Kathy, urikuzviwana kupi nhasi? Uri muChicago here?
Kathy: Zvakanaka, ndiri munzvimbo yeChicago. Uye neimwe nzira, moyo wangu nepfungwa dzangu zvinowanzo - kuburikidza neemail uye zvemagariro midhiya, ne - o, ndinofungidzira vangangoita gumi nemaviri vechidiki veAfghan zvekuti ndakakomborerwa kuziva nekushanya kuAfghanistan. Ivo vese vari mumamiriro asinganetsi, uye vamwe zvakanyanya kupfuura vamwe. Uye kufunga kwakakura nezve izvo zvingatotanga kuve nzira isiri yechisimba kumberi kwavo.
Stephanie: Zvakanaka, ngatisimirei ipapo ipapo, Kathy. Iwe unogona here kutaura kune zviri kuitika mumoyo mako nepfungwa, chii chiri kuitika kubva mumaonero ako?
Kathy: Zvakanaka, ndinonzwa kusuwa kukuru uye kuzvidemba. Ndiri kureva, ndinorarama mukunyaradzwa uye chengetedzo, iyo yakachena njodzi yekuzvarwa, uye zvakadaro ini ndinogara munyika umo yakawanda yekunyaradzwa kwedu uye chengetedzo yakagoneswa nehupfumi ihwo hwepamusoro chirimwa chiri zvombo. Uye tinoita sei kuti zvombo izvi zvitengeswe nekutengeswa uye kushandiswa, tobva tazotengesa zvimwe? Zvakanaka, isu tinofanirwa kushambadzira hondo dzedu.
Uye, munoziva, pfungwa yekuti vanhu vazhinji, kunyangwe ivo vakangokanganwa nezveAfghanistan, dai, dai vakafunga - uye handireve izvi kuti zvinzwike sekutonga - asi vanhu vazhinji vekuUS vakafunga kuti, "Zvakanaka, aren ' tirikubatsira madzimai nevana uko? ” Uye icho chaicho chaive chisiri chokwadi. Paive nevamwe vakadzi vakaita mari, pasina mubvunzo, mumaguta. Asi iwe unoziva, isu tinofanirwa kuzvibvunza isu, chii if United States yanga isati yakatsaurirwa kuvaka mabhesiki mazana mashanu muAfghanistan yese? Ko dai tisina kuzadza nzvimbo dzakakomberedza iwo mabheseni - uye chaizvo nyika yese - nezvombo zvedu? Ko kana mutemo watakadonhedza kuburikidza nemazhinji, mazhinji mabhomba, uye mazhinji ayo asina kunyorwa zvachose nekuti hondo yedrone haina - iyo CIA nemamwe mapoka aisatarisirwa kuti vachengete zvinyorwa zveavo vaibhomba.
Iwe unoziva, ko dai United States yainge yakanyatso tarisa simba rayo rakakura uye zviwanikwa mukutsvaga izvo zvinoda maAfghan uye zvobva zvabatsira kugadzirisa zvivakwa zvekurima nekuti munhu wese anoda chikafu. Saka, ese eaya chii-ifs anouya mupfungwa, uye nemanzwiro ekuzvidemba.
Ndiri kunyanya kuyeuchidzwa nezvazvo an article kuti Erica Chenoweth, Dr. Erica Chenoweth - panguva yaaive muColorado, uye Dr. Hakim, chipangamazano weboka reaya shamwari diki dzeAfghan. Hatitombovatumidza mazita. Zvava nengozi kwazvo kwavari.
Ivo vaviri vakanyora kuti dzimwe nguva chiito chisiri chechisimba munhu anogona kutora mumamiriro ezvinhu ane chisimba zvakanyanya is kutiza. Uye saka, ndinoreva, mangwanani ano chete, mumwe munhu ari mucherechedzi akanaka - takamuziva kwenguva yakareba muAfghanistan. Akatoshanda pamwe nehurumende semubatsiri kunhengo yeparamende.
Akati anogona kuona kuti pamwe hondo iri kuuya. Hondo yakawanda pakati pemapoka akasiyana aya. Uye saka, iwe unoitei? Zvakanaka, vazhinji vakati, "Ndiri kuda kubuda," kuitira kuchengetedzeka kwavo, asiwo nekuti havadi kutora pfuti. Havadi kurwa. Ivo havadi kuenderera nemitambo yekutsiva uye kutsiva.
Uye saka, kune avo vakatizira kunzvimbo dzakaita sePakistan, ivo vachiri vasina kuchengetedzeka chaizvo. Ndinonzwa kunge-- handigone kubatsira asi kunzwa kuzorora. "Zvakanaka, zvirinani kuti wabuda munjodzi." Uyezve tiri kuno kuUnited States uko madhora edu emitero aibhadhara aya ese nyonganiso nekumukira pamusoro pemakore mazhinji, akawanda akakonzerwa nemapato anorwisana. Uye United States iri kunyatsove chitsitsinho. Uye zvakadaro, isu hatinzwe kudedera hazvo. Kunyange zvakadaro, ndizvo zvave zviri mupfungwa dzangu. Ndatenda nekubvunza.
Michael: Unogamuchirwa, Kathy. Ndiri kuva nepfungwa mbiri nekupindura kune izvo zvawakangogovana. Chimwe chinhu chekupedzisira chawataura, uye ndinobheja kuti pamwe unobvumirana neni - Ini ndinobheja pane imwe nhanho yepfungwa dzedu pamwe nepfungwa dzedu, izvo hazvisi zvechokwadi zvachose kuti tiri kuenda tisina scot. Iwe unoziva, pane chinhu chakadai sekukuvara kwetsika. Uku ndiko kukuvara kunokonzereswa nevanhu nekukuvadza vamwe, izvo zvinonyora zvakadzika mundangariro dzavo.
Chinhu chinosuwisa nezvazvo - uye apa ndipo pamwe patinogona kuve nerumwe rubatsiro - vanhu havabatanidze iwo madota. Iwe unoziva, mukomana anopinda muchitoro muTennessee ndokupfura vanhu vese ava. Uye isu hatiise vaviri vaviri, iwe unoziva, takatsigira mutemo uyu wekuti mhirizhonga inopedza mhirizhonga. Isu hatizive kuti tiri kutumira meseji inotikuvadza isu pachedu epamba nyika.
Nekudaro, ndinofungidzira kuti rudzi irworwo rwakandiendesa kune imwe pfungwa huru futi, zvinova - izvo zvandairamba ndichinzwa ndiwo musimboti mukuru - wekuti kune mauto maviri chaiwo pasi pano: simba rekusaita zvechisimba uye simba remhirizhonga. Uye simba rechisimba rinowanzo shandura kutarisa kwako kumachini pane vanhu. Ndozvandainzwa.
Kathy: Zvakanaka, pane icho chinodikanwa chinenge chekuti hauone munhu kana iwe ukanangisa munhu ari nebara kana nechombo.
Iwe unoziva, chimwe chinhu chinouya mupfungwa, Michael, ndechekuti Timothy McVeigh, uyo aive musoja muIraq anga achingova munhu - unoziva, aive mwana achikurira munzvimbo diki. Handizivi chaizvo kuti akakurira kupi chaizvo. Ndinofunga ingave yaive kuPennsylvania.
Asi zvakadaro, aingova akanakisa, sezvavanotaura, mamaki. Aigona kurova chipfuro chaizvo, chaizvo. Nezvinangwa zve popup, akawana mamaki akareba kwazvo. Uye saka, paakanga ari muIraq, pakutanga akanyora mutsamba kuna tete vake, uye ichi chirevo chakananga, "Kuuraya maIraq kwaive kwakaoma pakutanga. Asi mushure mechinguva, kuuraya vaIraq kwakava nyore. ”
Timothy McVeigh akapfuurira kuva iye munhu akatakura zvinhu, ndinotenda, rori ine zvinoputika uye akarwisa Oklahoma Federal Building. Uye ini ndaigara ndichifunga kuti ndiani akadzidzisa, ndiani akadzidzisa Timothy McVeigh kutenda kuti kuuraya vanhu kunogona kuve nyore? Uye Timothy McVeigh akarangwa, zvirokwazvo. Asi uri kutaura chokwadi. Takazviranga.
Uye isu tave nenhamba yakakura kwazvo yevechidiki vakapedza maawa akakurisa vachitamba mitambo yemavhidhiyo uye vachinanga mablobs, munoziva, mabhurumu pachiratidziri. Ipapo Daniel Hale inosunungura izvo chaizvo zvinyorwa. Akashinga kudaro. Aive muongorori weAmerica muAfghanistan, uye akazoshandira imwe yekambani dzekuchengetedza.
Akaona nezvinyorwa zveUS kuti vakazvigadzira pachavo, kapfumbamwe pagumi mukati mekushanda kwemwedzi mishanu kwaaive ari, chinangwa chakazove chevanhu. Kwete munhu wavaifunga kuti munhu wacho. Uye saka anoburitsa ruzivo. Iye zvino ari kushumira kwemwedzi makumi mashanu mutirongo - makore mutirongo.
Uye saka, ndeipi yekupedzisira kurwisa kweUS, zvinoita, muKabul? Chaizvoizvo ingangove isiri yekupedzisira. Murume akasarudzwa sechirevo. Zita rake ainzi Zemari Ahmadi, uye aive baba vevana vakati wandei. Aigara mukomboni aine vanin'ina vake vaviri nemhuri yavo. Akange achifamba achitenderera Kabul kunosiya vanhu - nekuti aive nemota, uye aigona kuvabatsira nezverudo irworwo nekutora macanist emvura emhuri yake uye kupedzisa miniti yekupedzisira mabasa nekuti anga atosarudzwa kuwana imwe ye aya akakosha emavisa ekupinda munyika uye anouya kuUnited States.
Mhuri iyi yakanga iine mabhegi avo akarongedzwa. Uye neimwe nzira, nekuti aityaira Corolla chena, vashandisi vemadhoni eU.S. uye vanachipangamazano vavo vakafunga, "Muchinda uyu ari kunhonga zvinoputika. Aenda kuIslamic State mudunhu reKhorasan imba yakachengeteka. Ari kuzodzokera kune imwezve yekutengesa mukomboni inoenderana navo. Uyezve anogona kuenda kunhandare kunorwisa vanhu. ”
Vakauya neiyi fungidziro. Hapana chimwe chazvo chaive chokwadi. Nekuti zvese zvavanogona kunyatsoona mumadhoni avo emadhoni, mavhidhiyo emakamera, ndiwo mabhurumu uye madimikira akasviba. Uye saka, vakabva varidza mabhomba, vachifunga kuti kune uyu chete murume uye munhu waari kutaura naye. Uye Ahmed Zemari aive netsika, kwaaizodhonza mota kupinda munzira - uye chaizvo, kuve nemota muAfghanistan munzvimbo inoshanda-yevashandi chinhu chikuru.
Paaiidhonza mumugwagwa, airega mwanakomana wake mukuru kuipaka. Vana vese vadiki vaipinda mumota. Chaingova chinhu chavakaita. Uye saka, ndicho chinhu chekupedzisira chavakaita. Vana vanomwe. Vatatu vavo vari pasi pemakore mashanu. Vamwe, vana vachiri kuyaruka. Vechidiki vechidiki vakaurayiwa vese.
Zvino, pakanga pane kufukidzwa kweizvozvo. Paive nevatori venhau vakawanda vaigona kusvika panzvimbo iyi nekubvunzurudza vakapukunyuka. Asi chinhu chakadai chakange changoitika mavhiki maviri apfuura. Kumwe kurwiswa kwemhepo kuUS kwakapedza kiriniki uye chikoro chepamusoro muKandahar muLashkargah. Rudzi urwu rwechinhu runoramba ruchienderera.
Uye saka, izvozvi Mauto Emuchadenga, US Air Force iri kutsvaga madhora gumi emadhora kuti irambe ichienderera, yavanoti "Pamusoro peHorizon" kurwisa Afghanistan. Asi ndiani anoziva nezve izvi? Iwe unoziva, vashoma kwazvo vanhu, ndinofunga, vanogona kuona maitiro anga achiitika kubvira - ini ndinongo ronga chete date iyo yakadzokera kuna 10 inini. Ndine chokwadi kuti zvakaitika zvisati zvaitika.
Asi chimiro ndechekuti kurwiswa kunoitika, kungave kurwisa kwedrone kana kurwisa husiku, uye zvinobva zvaitika kuti "vawana munhu asiriye." Saka mauto, kana zvikatoonekwa, anovimbisa, "Tichaongorora izvozvo." Uyezve, kana ikasatsvedza kubva panhau, kana ikasangoita senge inyaya. Kana chokwadi chikabuda, "Hongu, makauraya vanhuwo zvavo. Iyi inogona kunge iri mhosva yehondo. ” Ipapo mumwe munhu anotora kudonha.
Panguva ino ichangopfuura, vakafanirwa kuenda kumusoro, General Lloyd Austin vakati, "Takanganisa." General MacKenzie vakati, "Hongu, takakanganisa." General Donahue vakati, "Hongu, takakanganisa." Asi isu tinoda zvinopfuura kukumbira ruregerero. Tinoda kuvimbiswa kuti United States iri kuzomira kuenderera nemutemo uyu wekuuraya nekudeura ropa nekushusha nekuparadza.
Tinofanira kuona kutsiva, kwete chete kudzoreredza kwemari, asiwo kuripwa kunokanganisa masisitimu akashata uye ane hutsinye.
Stephanie: Kathy, iwe unofunga sei kuti vanhu vanofanirwa kuenda nezvekuripira uku, kusanganisira kutsiva kwemari? Uye maTaliban anotamba sei mune izvo? Rubatsiro runogona sei kusvika kuvanhu? Unogona kutaura kune izvo here?
Kathy: Zvakanaka, kutanga kwezvose, ndinofunga tinofanirwa kuita izvo iwe naMichael zvawakatsigira muMetta Center kwenguva yakareba. Tinofanira kuwana hushingi hwekudzora kutya kwedu. Tinofanirwa kuve veruzhinji vasina kurohwa zvakanyanya kuti titye boka iri, kutya iro boka, kuti isu ticharamba tichiedza kubhengi kuedza kubvisa boka iri kuti tirege kutya ivo zvakare. Ndicho chinhu chimwe chete. Ini ndinofunga zvakakosha kuti tirambe tichivaka pfungwa yedu yekudzora kutya kwedu.
Chinhu chechipiri, zvakanyanya kuita, kusvika pakuziva vanhu vari kutakura mhedzisiro yehondo dzedu nekutama kwedu. Ndinofunga nezvazvo Sherri Maurin muSan Francisco uye Mazuva Ose Okuteerera yakabva kuOlympia, Washington mune dzimwe nzira. Asi mwedzi wega wega, kwemakore nemakore - makore gumi ndakaronga kufona kuitira kuti vechidiki muAfghanistan vakwanise kutaura nevanhu vanonakidza kwazvo pasirese, kusanganisira imi vaviri dzimwe nguva.
Ndinofunga izvozvo zvakakosha. Uye Sherri nevamwe vava kushanda saka, zvakaoma kubatsira vechidiki kuzadza zvikumbiro zvevisa uye kuyedza kutsvaga nzira dzekupa rubatsiro rwakakosha kune vanhu vanoda kuita ndege iyi - ndiko kuti, ndinofunga, mune dzimwe nzira chete kana chikuru chinhu chisina mhirizhonga kuita.
Nekudaro, chinhu chimwe chete chinogona kuitwa nevanhu kusangana nekubatana naSherri Maurin munharaunda kana kugara uchikurukura. Ini ndinofara chaizvo kubatsira chero munhu mhando shamwari, kuva shamwari kune mumwe wevanhu vanoda rubatsiro. Mafomu acho akaomarara, uye akaoma kunzwisisa. Izvo zvinodiwa zvinoshanduka nguva dzese. Saka, icho chinhu chimwe.
Zvakare nezve izvo kana kuti pangave nekuvapo kwekuchengetedza runyararo muAfghanistan, pane murume anonzi Dr. Zaher Wahab. Iye Afghan uye anga achidzidzisa mazhinji, makore mazhinji mumayunivhesiti eAfghan, asi zvakare kuLewis & Clark University muPortland. Anofunga kunze kwebhokisi. Anoshandisa fungidziro yake, obva ati, “Nei? Nei usingatarisi kuve nekuchengetedza runyararo kweUnited Nations? Imwe yaizobatsira kuchengetedza imwe mhando ye kuchengetedza uye kurongeka. ” Zvino, maTaliban angambobvuma izvozvo here? Zviri pachena, kusvika parizvino, veTaliban vari kushandisa kukunda kwavo, ndinofungidzira, kuti, "Kwete, hatifanirwe kunyatsoteerera zviri kutaurwa nevanhu vekunze."
Zvakaoma nekuti ini handidi kukurudzira, zvakanaka, wobva wavarova zvine hupfumi, nekuti ini ndinofunga izvo zvinokanganisa varombo zvakanyanya mune zvehupfumi. Masanctions anogara achidaro. Ivo vanogadzika vanhu vanotambura kwazvo munharaunda, uye handifunge kuti vachanyatso rova vakuru veTaliban. Uye, iwe unoziva, ivo vanogona kukwidza mari nekuchaja mutero pane yega mota imwe inodarika chero imwe yenhamba yemiganhu yakasiyana.
Ndiri kureva, vane zvombo zvakawanda zvavanotova nazvo nekuti vakazvitora kubva kumabhesi eUS nekune dzimwe nzvimbo dzavainge vasiya. Nekudaro, ini handikurudzire masanctions ezvehupfumi. Asi ini ndinofunga kuti kuedza kwese kwemumiriri kunofanirwa kuitwa kupa karoti kuti utaure kuTaliban, "Tarisa, tanga kuremekedza kodzero dzevanhu uye dzidzisa vanhu vako kushandisa dzimwe nzira kunze kwekurova vanhu vane ropa netambo dzemagetsi. Dzidzisa vanhu vako kuti vatambire kuti unofanirwa kuva nevakadzi munzvimbo dzese munharaunda kana uchizofambira mberi. ” Kutanga kudzidzisa izvo.
Uye zvingave zvakani karoti? Iwe unoziva, Afghanistan iri mune yehupfumi yemahara-kudonha uye yakatarisana nenjodzi iri kuuya mune zvehupfumi. Uye ivo vari mune yechina wave yeCOVID, iine chirwere chakarwadziswa zvakanyanya sisitimu yenyika. Uye vane kusanaya kwemvura mumatunhu makumi maviri nemana kubva makumi matatu nemana.
Kugona kukwira uchitenderera mumotokari yekutakura uye kumisikidza zvombo zvako hakuiti kuti iwe ugone kubata nemhando dzematambudziko ayo pasina mubvunzo anowedzera kushungurudzika kwevagari vanogona kuve vanotsamwa zvakanyanya, izvo zvavari kuyedza kutonga.
Stephanie: Uye Kathy, aya ndiwo mazano anoshanda. Ndatenda. Ini ndinotarisira kuzogovana navo futi. Iwe unonzwa here kuti maTaliban akashatiswa nevekumadokero midhiya, nevezvenhau vepasirese? Uye pane nzira here yekuita yekupaza kuburikidza nehunhu uhwu uye nekuona kuti sei vanhu vabatana neTaliban pakutanga, uye ndedzipi nzira dzatinogona kukanganisa iko kutenderera kwekunyanyisa?
Kathy: Ah, Stephanie, iwo mubvunzo unobatsira chaizvo. Uye ndinofanira kuzviongorora pachangu uye nemutauro wangu nekuti ndinoona, kunyangwe iwe uchitaura, hapana chakadai sekuti "The Taliban. ” Yakakura kwazvo bhurashi sitiroko. Kune akawanda akasiyana mapoka anosanganisira maTaliban.
Uye mubvunzo wako wekuti sei vanhu vachipinda mumapoka aya pakutanga, ichokwadi kwete kune veTaliban chete, asi kune mamwe akawanda mapoka ehondo, kuti vagone kutaura kuti vechidiki vaida kuisa chikafu patafura yemhuri dzavo, "Tarisa, unoziva, isu tine mari, asi unofanirwa kuve unodisa kutora pfuti kuti uve panhumbi kuti utore chero yemari iyi." Uye saka, kune vazhinji vechidiki maTalib varwi, ivo vanga vasina zvimwe zvakawanda sarudzo maererano nekugona kurima zvirimwa kana kurima zvipfuwo kana kugadzirisa zvivakwa zvekurima munzvimbo yavo. Iwe unoziva, opiamu ndiyo chirimwa chikurusa chiri kugadzirwa izvozvi uye icho chingavaunze mune rese dandemutande revatungamiriri vezvinodhaka nevatungamiriri vehondo.
Vazhinji vevadiki veTalib varwi vangangove vanhu vanogona kubatsirwa nekugona kudzidza kuverenga uye vanhu vese muAfghanistan vanobatsirwa nekugona kudzidza mitauro yemumwe nemumwe, Dari uye Pashto. Ndine chokwadi chekuti kwave nemifananidzo yakazadzwa neruvengo rwakavakwa, zvekuti pane maPasuns anofunga kuti maHazaras ese vagari vechipiri uye havafanirwe kuvimbwa. Uye maHazaras vavaka mifananidzo yevaPastun vese seine njodzi uye isingavimbwe nayo.
Shamwari dzangu diki muAfghanistan dzaive chiratidzo chevanhu vaida kusvika kuvanhu kune rimwe divi redivi. Vakataura nezve nyika isina muganho. Ivo vaida kuve neinterethnic mapurojekiti. Uye saka, vakagovera magumbeze kuvanhu vaishaya munguva yechando yakaoma, sezvavaingoita nguva dzese dzechando. Ndiri kureva, ivo vakaponesa hupenyu, ndinotenda, neaya magumbeze anorema.
Vakave nechokwadi chekuti vakadzi vakabhadharwa kugadzira magumbeze vaive chikamu kubva muboka reHazaric, chimwe chikamu kubva muchiTajik boka, uye chikamu kubva kuPashto grouping. Ivo vakashanda chaizvo nesimba kuti vave nechokwadi chekuti ivo vairemekedza vemarudzi ese matatu akasiyana madzinza. Uyezve zvakafanana nekugovera. Ivo vaizozviita poindi yekukumbira mamoski anomiririra aya matatu akasiyana madzinza kuti avabatsire kuona nzira yekugovera zvakaenzana magumbeze iwayo. Uye ivo vakaita zvimwechetezvo nevana vakauya kuchikoro chavo chevana vekumigwagwa uye mhuri dzakabatsirwa kuburikidza neizvozvo.
Icho chaive chirongwa chidiki, uye chakagoneswa nerupo rwevakawanda, vanhu vazhinji, kusanganisira vazhinji muCalifornia uye vazhinji muPoint Reyes. Asi iwe unoziva, zvakadaro, hurumende yeUnited States yakadurura mabhiriyoni, kana asiri mabhirioni emadhora muhondo muAfghanistan neIraq. Uye ini ndinofunga muhuwandu vakawedzera mukaha pakati pemapoka akasiyana uye vakawedzera mukana wekuti vanhu vatore zvombo nekuzvinongedzera kune mumwe nemumwe.
Wakave chokwadi kuti usatambire pfungwa yekuti kune rimwe bhuru rakakura rinonzi, "VaTaliban." Isu tinofanirwa kuronga nhanho tichidzoka kubva ipapo. Asi zvakare zvakare mhando yekutsvinya zvakapotsa uye edza kuona hunhu hweavo vanonzi vavengi.
Michael: Ehe, tichiona hunhu - zvakare, Kathy, sekuziva kwedu kwazvo, izvo zvinongo shandura munda wako wekuona zvakakwana, zvinoshandura maonero ako. Unotanga kuona zvinhu zvakasiyana. Ndinoziva rimwe boka rakauya nemari yechipo, ndinotenda yaive Afghanistan. Yakanga iri nguva yakapfuura; yakavapa mari mune tarisiro yekuti vachakura zvirimwa zvekudya zvinodikanwa, uye pachinzvimbo, vanhu vacho vakarima maruva.
Saka, vakabvunza, "Sei wazviita izvozvo?" Ivo ndokuti, "Zvakanaka, nyika inofanira kunyemwerera." Isu tinofanirwa, iwe unoziva, kudzosa izvo zvakanaka mune imwe yakanaka hupenyu-inosimbisa fomu. Zvingave zviri nyore kwazvo kana tikashandura chimiro chedu chepfungwa, sekutaura kwangu, kubva, sei isu tichigona kudira mamwe mafuta mamwechete pamvura imwechete inoshungurudzika? Kana, tinowana kupi imwe mhando yemafuta? Ndo izvo maVoices eCreative Nonviolence neMetta Center anga achishanda zvakaoma kudaro, kukwidza mureza wekusagadzikana uye nekukurumidza mhirizhonga inowira mumaonero.
Stephanie: Zvino Kathy, wave kuAfghanistan kanopfuura makumi matatu nguva?
Kathy: Ndizvozvo.
Stephanie: Saka, ngatitaurei zvishoma nezverwendo rwako semunhu uye kuti chiitiko ichocho chakachinja sei iwe. Ini zvakare ndoda kupa vateereri vedu pfungwa yezvazvakaita kuva muAfghanistan. Uye kwete muKabul chete, asi ndine chokwadi kuti waenda kumatunhu ekunze. Unogona here kupenda pikicha yeAfghanistan kwatiri nekuvanhu?
Kathy: Zvakanaka, unoziva, ndine shamwari, Ed Keenan, aive nhengo yeumwe wedu wekutanga nhume kuti aende kunoshanyira Kabul. Uye iye nekuzvininipisa kwazvo akanyora chinyorwa achiti akanzwa kuti akaona Afghanistan kuburikidza nekiyi kiyi. Iwe unoziva, ichokwadi chaizvo kwandiri.
Ndinoziva imwe nharaunda yeKabul uye ndaingofara pane dzimwe nguva kuenda kuPanjshir ino inzvimbo yakanaka uko Emergency Kuvhiya Center yevakabatwa paHondo ndaive nechipatara. Takanga tiri vaenzi kuchipatara ichocho kwevhiki. Uye pane dzimwe nguva shomanene, dzakaita serwendo rwemumunda, vamwe vedu takakwanisa kuenda kuva vaenzi veaimbove mushandi wezvekurima. Akaurayiwa. Iye nemhuri yake vaitigamuchira munzvimbo yePanjshir. Uye ndakashanyira vanhu muBamiyan. Uye zvino pane dzimwe nguva, kumucheto kweKabul, pamwe kumuchato wemusha.
Asi zvakadaro, zvaivhenekera zvikuru kupinda mumisha kune zvishoma zvandaiita nekuti vamwe vanambuya vekuBamiyan, vakandiudza, "Unoziva, tsika dzaunonzwa nezvadzo - idzo vaTaliban vanochengeta vakadzi mazana emakore kusati kwambove nechero maTaliban. Izvi ndizvo zvatagara tichiita. ”
Nekudaro, mumamisha, mumaruwa, vamwe vakadzi - kwete vese, asi vamwe - havaone mutsauko mukuru pakati pehutongi hwaAshraf Ghani nehurumende yake nehutongi hweTaliban. Muchokwadi, sangano revaongorori veAfghan rakati vamwe vanhu munzvimbo dzavanozvisanganisa uye vakangoedza kuona zvakaita sekugara munzvimbo inotongwa neTaliban. Vamwe vakati kwavari, "Munoziva, kana zvasvika nyaya dzekutonga dzinogadzirisa kusawirirana pamusoro penzvimbo kana ivhu, tinosarudza matarenda eTaliban nekuti matare ehurumende ari kuKabul," izvo zvinofanirwa kutaridza, munoziva, chaizvo, kure, "vane huwori hwakanyanya tinofanirwa kuramba tichibhadhara nhanho imwe neimwe yenzira, uye tinoshaya mari. Uye kururamisira kunoitwa zvichibva nekuti ndiani awana imwe mari. ” Nekudaro, icho chingangove chimwe chinhu chakabata hupenyu hwevanhu, vangave vari varume, vakadzi, kana vana.
Pandaizoenda kunzvimbo iyoyo yevashandi yeKabul, mumakore achangopfuura, pandakangopinda mumba mavo, handina kusiya. Ipo kana tikangogara kwemwedzi kana mwedzi nehafu, kushanya kwedu kwakapfupika uye kupfupika, semazuva gumi angave akajairika nekuti zvakatanga kuve nenjodzi kushamwari dzedu dzechidiki kugamuchira vekuMadokero. Zvakaunza kunyumwa kwakawanda. Sei uchibatana nevanhu vanobva Kumadokero? Vari kuitei? Vari kukudzidzisa here? Uri kutora tsika dzekuMadokero? Iwo akange atove manyuko ekufungira zvisati zvaitika maTalib asati asvika Kabul.
Ini ndingati kusava nehanya, fungidziro, kunzwira tsitsi, hunyanzvi hwehutungamiriri, kuseka kwakanaka kwandakawana pakati pevechidiki zvekuti ndakakomborerwa kushanya, yaigara iri nguva dzose, chiitiko chitsva kwazvo.
Ini ndinogona kunzwisisa kuti nei mukoti weItaly wandakambosangana naye (zita rake ainzi Emanuele Nannini) akati aienda nenzira, kumusoro mumakomo aine hombodo hombe kumusana, uye anga achiendesa zvekurapa. Yakanga iri nguva yake yekupedzisira kuenda nekuti rwendo rwake rwemakore mana rwekuve neEmergency Surgical Centres yeVakatambudzwa veHondo rwaipera.
Vanhu vaiziva kuti aizove achivasiya uye ivo vakabva vaenda - vakafamba maawa mana muchando munguva yechando kuti vakwanise kutaura zvakanaka uye nekutenda. Zvino akati, “Aa. Ndakavada. ” Ini ndinofunga ndicho chiitiko icho vakawanda vakave nacho. Zvekare, iwe unogona kubvunza Sherri Maurin. Iwe unongowa mukuda nevanhu vazhinji vakanaka, vakanaka, uye vane mutsa vanhu vaisatoreva kuti hatikuvadze.
Ndinoyeuka shamwari yangu yechidiki ichiti makore apfuura kwandiri, “Kathy, enda kumba undoudza vabereki vevechidiki munyika yako, 'Usaendese vana vako kuAfghanistan. Kune njodzi kwavari pano.
Saka, paigara paine pfungwa, ndinofunga, kune vechidiki uye dzimwe mhuri uye vechidiki vandakasangana navo kuti vaisada kukuvadza vanhu muUnited States, asi ivo vaisada. vanhu muUnited States kuti varambe vachitumira masoja nemauto nezvombo munyika yavo.
Uye ndinorangarira apo iwo mutemo wakakura wemhepo wakaputika, chombo chakasimba kwazvo, chikuru - chombo chakajairika muuto reUnited States rakapfupika nebhomba renyukireya, apo iro rakarova mugomo, ivo vakangovhunduka. Vakafunga - iwe unoziva, nekuti vanhu vaizvidaidza, "Amai veMabhomba Ese," muUnited States - uye ivo vakangobvongodzwa zvachose. Sei? Sei ungade kuita izvi?
Zvakanaka, zvakazoitika kuti mukati megomo iri maive nenzvimbo yekuchengetera zvombo, uye mhando yekuchengeta pakavanzika kutungamira kweuto reUnited States iro rakanga rakavakwa nemauto eUS makore mazhinji apfuura. Mauto eUS aiziva kuti yaivepo, uye vaisada kuti maTaliban aishandise kana mamwe mapoka ehondo kuti aishandise, saka vakaifuridza.
Asi iwe unoziva, ini handina kumbonzwa mameseji akasimba akadaro nezve kukosha kwekubvisa hondo sezvandakanzwa kubva kune vechidiki ava muAfghanistan. Ivo vaigara vachitumira meseji iyoyo.
Stephanie: Uye iwe unogona kupenda zvishoma zvishoma zvemufananidzo zvakare nezve zvazviri kuva munharaunda iyoyo muKabul? Iwe unofanirwa kubuda, unowana sei zvinhu zvako? Wakakunda sei kutya kwekugona kuita chisimba?
Kathy: Kushomeka kwekuwanikwa kwaigara kuri kwechokwadi. Ndinoyeuka ndiri ipapo imwe nguva mvura payakapera. Unoziva, wapfuura, wapfuura, wapfuura. Uye nerombo rakanaka, muridzi wemba akatora mutoro wekuchera tsime. Uye nerombo rakanaka, mushure menguva, mvura yakarova. Uye saka, dambudziko iri rekushaya mvura rakadzikiswa.
Paive nenjodzi dzakawanda mukati memhuri dzakasiyana zvekuti vechidiki vaigara mumafashama nemapako-ins, uye zvimbuzi zvaiwanzove zvechinyakare. Pese pandinoenda, chaizvo nguva dzese dzechando pandaive kuAfghanistan, mhuri yese yaiuya neimwe mhando yehutachiona hwehutachiona. Uye katatu, ini pachangu ndaiva nemabayo. Ndiri kureva, ini ndakanga ndisina hutachiona hwavakavaka, uye ini ndachembera. Nekudaro, vanhu vaigara vakatarisana nenjodzi dzehutano.
Hupenyu hwemhepo hwaityisa munguva yechando nekuti munzvimbo dzine hurombo vanhu havakwanise kutenga huni. Havagone kutenga marasha, saka vakatanga kupisa mapurasitiki nematai. Uye chiutsi chaigona kungogadzira mhando yemhepo yaive yakaipa kwazvo. Ndiri kureva, sezvazviri, kana iwe wainge uchikwenya mazino ako waisvipa mate matema. Uye izvo hazvina kunaka kuvanhu.
Ndiri kushamiswa nekusimba kweshamwari dzangu diki kugona kubata kuburikidza neino inotonhora inotonhora nguva yechando. Iko hakuna kudziya kwemukati, saka unoziva, iwe unopfeka nguwo dzako dzese, uye unodedera zvakanyanya mukati mezuva rezuva.
Ini ndakangofadzwawo nekugadzirira kwavo kusunga, kukwira mugomo, nekushanyira neshirikadzi dzakange dzakasundidzirwa kukwira mugomo, chaizvo. Paunokwira kumusoro, mvura shoma inowanikwa uye saka rendi dzinodzika, uye une vakadzi vanogara pasheti. Uye nzira chete yavanogona kufudza vana ndeyekutumira vaviri vavo kumusika kuti vatsvage, munoziva, pasi pemusika wezvimedu zvezvikafu kana kuyedza kutora vamwe kunyoreswa sevashandi vevana.
Uye saka shamwari dzangu diki, neimwe nzira ivo vaiita zvekutarisa, yakanaka kwazvo mhando yekutarisa nemabhuku avo ezvinyorwa uye zvinyoreso zvavo vachibvunza vakadzi vanova ivo chete vakuru mumhuri. Iko hakuna murume kuti awane mari. Vakadzi havagone kuenda kunoshanda. Vane vana.
Vaivabvunza, "Unodya bhinzi kangani pavhiki?" Uye kana mhinduro yaive, "Pamwe kaviri," dai vanga vachinyanya kudya chingwa kana mupunga, kana vasina mukana wekuwana mvura yakachena, kana mwana ari iye anotambira mari, saka vaitora pepa rekuongorora uye mutsa yekuisa pamusoro. Uye vakaenda kuvanhu ivavo ndokuti, "Tarisai, tinofunga kuti isu tinokwanisa kana isu kukubatsira kuti upedze munguva yechando. Hezvino zvinhu zvekugadzira rinorema quilt gumbeze. Heino jira. Unoisona. Tichadzoka tozoitora. Tichakubhadharai, uye tichazvipa pachena kuvapoteri vari mumisasa yevapoteri. ”
Uyezve vamwe - shamwari yangu yechidiki uyo ave kuIndia - aigona kundiendesa kunzvimbo yaakazvipira pamwe neiyo. Aive mudzidzisi anozvipira, uye vana ava vaimuda. Uye iye anokwanisa kurarama ane tsandanyama chirwere. Haisi zvakanyanya zvekuti anoda wiricheya. Achiri kugona kufamba.
Ndakataura kunzwira tsitsi. Iye anongova nekunzwira tsitsi kukuru kune vamwe vanhu vari kubata nemamiriro ezvinhu ari kunze kwekugona kwavo mune dzimwe nzira. Uye ini ndakangozviona izvo zvekare. Saka, pandinoona vana vachiti, "Imwe nyika inganditore?" I think, “Ah zvangu. Canada, United States, UK, Germany, Portugal, Italy. ” Chero imwe nyika inga - inofanirwa kunge ichisvetuka nemufaro kuita kuti vechidiki ava vapinde munyika mavo, sekugamuchira kwatinofanira kuita munhu wese weHaiti anoda kuuya kuno. Uye tenda, isu tine zvakawanda zvekugovana. Rakawanda rebasa rekutenderera. Uye kana tiri kunetsekana nemari, tora madhora gumi emadhora kubva kuAir Force uye wovaudza, “Unoziva chii? "Hatisi kuzokwanisa kubhadhara mari yenyu yekuuraya vanhu."
Stephanie: Kathy, ndiri kufunga nezve apo mutauriri waBiden, achipindura mifananidzo iyo iri pamuganhu nevaHaiti, vakati zvinotyisa uye hapana mamiriro ezvinhu angave mhinduro yakakodzera. Ndichiri kurumbidza chirevo icho, zvinoita kunge zvine musoro uye zvine hunhu, ndinofunga isu tinogona kutora iwo manzwiro uye toaisawo kumubvunzo mukuru wehondo. Pane here chero mamiriro ezvinhu mukati ayo anoita kunge akakodzera mhinduro muna 2021?
Kathy: Hongu. Zvirokwazvo. Iwe unoziva, kune akawanda, mazhinji, mazhinji mhuri dzevaHaiti muno muUnited States ivo pachavo vakaomerwa, pasina mubvunzo, kuyambuka miganhu. Asi ivo vangave vakagadzirira kutiudza, "Heino nzira yamunogamuchira nayo vanhu munharaunda medu." Uye ini ndinofunga isu tinofanirwa kutarisa zvakanyanya kumatunhu ekugona ane nharaunda nekusunungura iwo masimba kumusoro.
Ndiri kureva, ndine chokwadi chekuti kune nharaunda munzvimbo dzese dzeUnited States dzinogona kurangarira apo nharaunda dzeVietnam dzakapinda mumaguta avo uye vaingotya indasitiri nehunyanzvi hwekuziva uye runako urwo vazhinji vevapoteri vakaunza mukati. mharaunda yedu. Ini chokwadi ndakazviona munzvimbo yepamusoro yeguta reChicago.
Saka, sei isu tichizoda kungofungidzira kuti neimwe nzira isu tiri Sacrosanct, rakakwirira boka, uye isu hatigone kupindirwa nevanhu vanoda kuuya munyika medu? Nekunaka nekuda, nyika ino yaive imba yevagari vemo vakaurayiwa nevatangi nevateveri vavo, pakutanga. Kuurayiwa nekuda kwevagari vemo vaivenga kwavari. Uyezve rimwe nerimwe boka revatorwa rakasvika kuUnited States kazhinji raiuya nekuti vaitiza varwi uye kutambudzwa munyika dzavo.
Saka, wadii kuva netsitsi? Wadii kutaura kuti munhu wese apinde, hapana abuda? Bvisa mari muchiuto uye tora zvombo kubva muturakiti uye ugone kutsvaga nzira dzekuve vanodiwa kutenderera pasirese kuti pasave neruvengo. Hatingaonekwe sekutyisidzira simba.
Stephanie: Uye zvinoita sezvowo, nzira iyo iwe yawakatsanangura vanhu muAfghanistan uye nerupo rwavo kwauri semuenzi, icho chinhu icho vanhu vekuAmerican vanogona kudzidza kubva kuAfghanistan.
Kathy: Eya, zvirokwazvo iyo pfungwa yekusaita zvechisimba inosanganisira kugadzirira kwakakomba kwekugovana zviwanikwa, iko kugadzirira kwakasimba kuve webasa pane kutonga vamwe. Uye kugadzirira kwakakomba kurarama zvakapusa.
Iwe unoziva, zvakare, ini ndoda kusimbisa kuti pandakanga ndiri muKabul, ndakanga ndisingazive chero munhu aive nemota. Ini ndaigona kuona zviri nyore kuti sei murume uyu, Zemari Ahmadi, akafungidzirwa, munoziva, murume anoenda munharaunda. Aive nemota. Iko kunwiwa kwemafuta kwevaAfghans zvichienzaniswa nenyika dzese maererano nekukuvara kwenzvimbo iri miniscule. Vanhu havana mafiriji. Ivo zvirokwazvo havana mhepo yekudziya. Kwete mota zhinji. Mabhasikoro akawanda.
Vanhu vanorarama hupenyu hwakareruka. Hapana kupisa mukati. Vanhu vanotora chikafu chavo vakagara mudenderedzwa pasi, uye vanogovana izvo zvekudya neupi zvake angave ari kuuya pamusuwo. Uye chaizvo, izvi zvinosuruvarisa, asi mushure mekudya kwese iwe waizoona imwe yeshamwari dzedu dzechidiki achiisa chero zvasara muhomwe yepurasitiki, uye vaiuya nazvo kuzambuko nekuti ivo vaiziva kuti kugara pasi pebhiriji vanhu avo vari pakati pemamirioni avo vakapindwa muropa neopiyamu.
Uye zvinosuruvarisa, chimwe chokwadi chehondo ndechekuti kunyangwe maTaliban pakutanga akange abvisa kugadzirwa kweopiyamu, mumakore makumi maviri ekugara kweUS, kunyangwe mabhirioni achidururwa mumushonga-narcotic, iyo opium chigadzirwa chakasimudzira kumusoro. Uye ndiyo imwe nzira iyo inobata vanhu muUnited States zvakare nekuti nehuwandu hwekugadzirwa kweopiyamu kunobva kuAfghanistan, inoderedza mutengo weopiyamu uye inobata vanhu vanobva kuUK kuenda kuUS uye muEurope nekuMiddle East.
Michael: Hongu. Kathy, ndinokutendai zvikuru. Izvo zvakafanana zvakaitika muColumbia, nenzira. Isu tinopinda imomo tinobhomba minda iyi uye toedza kupedza cocoa uye tinopedzisira tave nemhinduro chaiyo. Ini ndaida kugovana newe zvinhu zvakati. Ini ndaive kumusangano kuUK imwe nguva, nguva refu yapfuura, chaizvo, uye uyu mubvunzo wezvedu zvatiri kuita muAfghanistan wakakwira.
Paive nemukadzi mukati mevateereri akange ave kuAfghanistan, uye iye aichema maziso ake kunze. Uye chaizvo, hongu, zvakandibata zvakanyanya. Iye akati, “Unoziva, tiri kubhomba aya 'makomo' uye kwatiri, anongova makomo. Asi vane masystem ekuunza mvura kubva kumakomo kudzika kumamisha ane mazana emakore. "Uye uku ndiko kukuvara kwechibatiso kwatisingatarisise isu." Saka, icho chaive chinhu chimwe.
Uye imwe yacho ingori iyi. Ndiri kurangarira chimwe chinhu chakataurwa naJohan Galtung, icho chaakabvunzurudza vanhu vazhinji vechiArabic nezvehugandanga. Akabvunza, "Unodei?" Uye iwe unoziva zvavakataura? "Tinoda kuremekedza chitendero chedu." Uye hazvingatipe isu chinhu. Uye zvakafanana ndezvechokwadi kune maTaliban.
Ehezve, vane miitiro isina anogona kuremekedzwa. Asi hwaro hwacho ndechekuti kana iwe ukakuremekedza vanhu nezvechimwe chinhu chiri chepedyo kwavari sechitendero chavo, vanozozvibata zvakanyanya. Zvakangoti, "Zvakanaka, tichazviita zvakanyanya." "Tichaita nani kuraira," sekutaura kwaShylock. Tinofanira kuita chimwe chinhu chinopikisa uye kudzosera iyo psychology. Ndozvandiri kufunga.
Kathy: Ini ndinofunga zvakare tinoda pamwe kuziva kuti chinamato chikuru, ndinotenda, munyika medu nhasi chave chiuto. Ini ndinofunga yakawanda yetsika dzinoitika mudzimba dzekunamatira, neimwe nzira, chiutsi cheutsi, uye zvinodzivirira vanhu kuti vaone kuti isu tinonyatsoisa kutenda kwedu mukugona kutonga zviwanikwa zvevamwe vanhu, kutonga zviwanikwa zvevamwe vanhu, uye kuita zvine chisimba. Uye nekuti isu tine izvo kana isu takave nekutonga ikoko, isu takakwanisa kurarama zvakaringana - pamwe nekushandisa zvakawandisa, nekutonga kwakawanda zviwanikwa nekuti tinotarisira kuwana zviwanikwa zvakakosha zvevamwe pamitengo yakatemwa.
Saka, ndinofunga, iwe unoziva, maitiro edu echitendero ave achikuvadza vamwe vanhu sevaya veTaliban. Tingave tisiri kurova vanhu pachena munzvimbo yekunze, asi unoziva, kana mabhomba edu - aya, semuenzaniso, kana Drone ichipisa huni hwegehena, unogona here kufungidzira chombo icho - hachisi chete chinomisa zana mapaundi ezvakaumbwa nesimbi yakanyungudutswa mota kana imba, asizve yazvino vhezheni yacho, inonzi [R100X] chombo, inomera, ingangoita, senge mashizha matanhatu. Vanopfura sezvinoita switchblade. Makuru, marefu mashizha. Wobva wafungidzira gwenzi remuchakwi, rudzi rwechinyakare. Ivo vanotanga kutenderera uye ivo vanocheka, ivo vanochekacheka miviri yeuyo chero akarwiswa. Zvino, iwe unoziva, izvo zvinotyisa, handizvo here?
Uye fungidzira vana Ahmedi. Ndiko kwakave kupera kwehupenyu hwavo. Saka, tine maitiro akaipa kwazvo. Uye kusagadzikana isimba rechokwadi. Tinofanira kutaura chokwadi uye kuzvitarisa pagirazi. Uye izvo zvandangotaura ndizvozvo chaizvo, zvakaoma chaizvo kutarisa. Asi ndinofunga zvinoda kuti unzwisise zvirinani kuti tiri vanaani uye kuti tingataure sei chaizvo, “Tine hurombo. Tine hurombo kwazvo, ”uye ita muripo unoti hatisi kuzoenderera mberi izvi.
Stephanie: Kathy Kelly, tangosarirwa nemaminetsi mashoma uye ndinoshamisika kuti urikunzwa sei pamusoro peAfghanistan chaizvo kusave pamberi pehana dzevanhu kwemakore akawanda kusvika United States yabuda. Iwe wakabvunzurudzwa pane Democracy Zvino uye National Catholic Reporter. Wazara pamusoro penyaya izvozvi. Vanhu vanoda kutaura newe. Iwe unofunga chii chatinofanira kunzwa kuti tirege izvi zviende kana misoro inomira ichinongedzera? Chii chatinofanira kuita?
Kathy: Zvakanaka, ichokwadi kuti kutarisisa kwakabhadharwa mumavhiki matatu apfuura pane akabhadharwa pamusoro pemakore makumi maviri apfuura kuAfghanistan. Mubvunzo wakakura kudai, asi ndinofunga kuti nyaya idzi dzinotibatsira kuti tinzwisise chokwadi chedu.
Uye saka, iwe paunounza nazvo mukati memunharaunda yekoreji koreji kana yunivhesiti yepedyo, tinogona here kubvunza mapurofesa akagara pamwe nemachancellor kuti vanetseke nezveAfghanistan chikamu chedzidzo yavo, chikamu chemamwe ma extracurriculars. Kana tichifunga nezvedzimba dzekunamatira, masinagoge nemamoski nemachechi, tinogona kuvabvunza, mungatibatsire here kugadzira kunetseka chaiko kwevanhu vanobva kuAfghanistan?
Tinogona kubatsira kuunza vapoteri kunharaunda yedu uye kudzidza kubva kwavari? Tinogona here kuva nevanhu vanozo shamwaridzana navo uye vagova sosi yekudyidzana yevana vakanamatira muAfghanistan izvozvi? Kana kune vanhu vari chaizvo mune yakashata mamiriro muPakistan? Tinogona here kutendeukira kumakambani edu emunharaunda ezvokudya uye mapoka ezvakatipoteredza uye nyanzvi dzezvemagariro ndokuti, “Unoziva chii? Ava vana muAfghanistan vanofarira kudzidza permaculture. "
Munoziva, ndakabvunza shamwari dzangu diki kuAfghanistan, “Unoda kufunga nezvekunyora nyaya yako. Unoziva, pamwe nyora tsamba yekufungidzira kune mumwe munhu anga ari mupoteri kubva kune imwe nhambo. ” Saka, pamwe tinogona kuita zvakafanana. Iwe unoziva, kunyorerana uye kugovana nyaya. Ndatenda nekubvunza iwo wakakosha mubvunzo zvakare.
Yese mibvunzo yako yanga iri - zvinoita kunge kuenda kumberi. Ndiri kuonga chaizvo nguva yako mangwanani ano. Ndatenda nekuteerera. Imi vaviri garai muchiteerera.
Stephanie: Ndinokutendai zvikuru nekubatana nesu nhasi. Uye pachinzvimbo chevateereri vedu, ndinokutendai zvikuru, Kathy Kelly.
Kathy: Zvese zvakaringana. Zvikuru, maita basa. Wonekana, Michael. Wonekana, Stephanie.
Michael: Bye-bye, Kathy. Kusvikira nguva inotevera.
Stephanie: Chisarai.
Kathy: Zvese zvakaringana. Kusvikira nguva inotevera.
Stephanie: Isu tanga tichingotaura naKathy Kelly, mumwe wenhengo dzakavamba dzeVoices muRenje, akazozivikanwa seVoices for Creative Nonviolence. Iye murongi-mubatanidzwa kuBan Killer Drones Campaign, muratidziri na World Beyond War, uye anga achienda kuAfghanistan kanoda kusvika makumi matatu. Iye ane anoshamisa maonero.
Tasara nemaminetsi mashoma. Michael Nagler, ndapota tipei Rudzi rwekusagadzikana. Wanga uchiratidzira zvakadzama pamusoro pekukuvara kwetsika mushure mekubvunzurudzwa kwekupedzisira naKelly Borhaug uye ndinotarisira kuti unogona kutaura zvishoma zvishoma nezvekuti mifungo iyi yanga ichikura sei mumaminetsi mashoma anotevera.
Michael: Hongu. Ndiwo mumwe wemibvunzo yako yakanaka, Stephanie. Ndanyora chinyorwa, uye ndiri kugadzirira kunyora zvimwe. Chinyorwa ichi chinonzi, "Afghanistan neKukuvara Kwetsika."
Pfungwa yangu huru ndeyekuti aya maviri emamwe akati wandei makuru, zviratidzo zvisingatadzike zvichitiudza, “Dzokera. Uri kufamba nenzira isiri iyo. ” Iyo Afghanistan imwe inoreva kuti kubvira 1945, United States yakashandisa - tora iyi - $ 21 tiririyoni. Chimbofungidzira izvo zvataigona kunge takaita nazvo. $ 21 trillion pamatanho akareba ehondo, hapana imwe yadzo "yakakundwa" mupfungwa yakajairika. Kundirangaridza nezvemumwe munhu akati, "Haukwanise kukunda muhondo zvakare sekukunda kwaungaita kudengenyeka kwenyika."
Chimwe chikamu chechinyorwa changu, "Kukuvara kwetsika" chiri pamwero wakasiyana kwazvo, asi zvakatonyanya kutaura neimwe nzira, zvazvinoita kumunhu kuti atore chikamu chinokuvadza nekukuvadza vamwe.
Tagara tichifunga izvozvo, unoziva, “Ha-ha. Idambudziko rako kwete rangu. ” Asi kunyangwe kubva kuurouroscience mazuva ano, tinogona kuratidza kuti kana iwe uchikuvadza mumwe munhu, iko kukuvara kunonyora muuropi hwako, uye kana tikazvifunga izvo, kuti haugone kukuvadza vamwe usingazvikuvadze. Haisi kungozvibata kwetsika. Icho chokwadi chehuropi sainzi. Kunyangwe paine masimba etsika muchadenga, iro divi uyezve iyo yekuti senzira yekugadzirisa matambudziko haichashande. Isu tinonyatsokurudzirwa kutsvaga imwe nzira.
Nekudaro, ini ndiri kuenda kujekesa boka rinotaridzika chaizvo, rinotarisira kwandiri. Isangano rakakura, semasangano mazhinji nhasi ari kuita mutsauko worudzi urwu, anoshanda pamwe, mamwe mapoka akawanda akadaro Kudzidzira Shanduko uye zvichingodaro chikamu chazvo. Kubuda kweMabasa, uye inonzi tichimhanya.
Uye izvo zvandinonyanya kufarira nezvazvo, nekuti ichi chinhu chandinofunga kuti tanga tichishaya kwenguva yakareba, ndechekuti ivo havasi kungoronga, asi ivo vari, vakanyanya kwazvo pakubatsira iwe kuronga chimwe chinangwa. kana imwe nyaya. Asi ivo vari kuitawo kudzidziswa uye zano uye ivo vari kushanda izvo kunze kwazvo sainzi.
Icho chiri nyore kutarisa kumusoro: chete tichimhanya. Iyo webhusaiti inoyevedza uye zvese nezveboka iri zvakandirova sekukurudzira. Kunyanya chokwadi, uye isu tiri pano kuNonviolence Radio mangwanani ano, kuti ivo vanotaura zvakanyanya munzvimbo dzakakosha kuti kusagadzikana kuchazoteererwa mune zvese zvavanoita. Saka, ndiyo Momentum.
Pamusoro pechinyorwa chabuda, "Afghanistan uye Kukuvara Kwetsika," Ini ndaida kutaura kuti kuYunivhesiti yeToledo musi wa29 wemwedzi uno, Gunyana, kuchave ne kuratidza kwedu firimu. Ikoko zvakare kwaive nekuratidzwa munguva pfupi yapfuura muRaleigh, North Carolina kuTriumphant Film Festival. Ini ndinofunga vanofanirwa kunge vane imwe nhepfenyuro yezvose zvakaratidzwa.
Saka, chii chimwe chiri kuitika? Gosh zvakanyanya. Isu tangove kumagumo e Campaign Nonviolence Chiito Vhiki iyo yakapera pa21st, iyo International Day reRunyararo, kwete zvakangoitika. Uye ini ndinogona kunge ndakambotaura izvi zvisati zvaitika, asi gore rino pakanga pasina zvishoma kana mazana mana mazana mana ezviito nezviitiko zvehunhu husina mhirizhonga hwaiitika kutenderera nyika.
Kuuya nekukurumidza, Gumiguru 1, zuva rakapfuura zuva rekuzvarwa kwaMahatma Gandhi, kuStanford University shamwari yedu Clay Carson achange aine imba yakavhurika apo patinogona kudzidza zvakawanda nezve chirongwa chinonakidza chavakatanga kudaidza, "Iyo World House Chirongwa. ” Saka, enda kuMLK Peace and Justice Center kuStanford uye utsvage iyo yakavhurika imba uye kuveze iyo nguva neChishanu, Gumiguru 1.
Stephanie: Zvakare, neChishanu, Gumiguru 1 tichave tichiita kumwe kuongorora kweThe Third Harmony firimu naEla Gandhi aive kuNonviolence Radio mavhiki maviri apfuura. Izvo zvichave mukupemberera kwe Zuva Renyika Dzepasi Pokusasununguka, uye zvichave zvakadaro nzira muSouth Africa. Asi ichave ichiwanikwa online.
Michael, hatina kutaura kuti Nyamavhuvhu 21st raive Zuva reRunyararo. Iyo Metta Center inosangana neUnited Nations kuburikidza ECOSOC. Tine hunhu hwekukurukurirana. Mutumbi wepasi rose urikugadzirisa nyaya dzerunyararo uye kusagadzikana. Isu tinofara kubatsira kutsigira izvozvo.
Uye pane iyi inguva yenguva yakakosha pakati paGunyana 21st rinova iro Zuva reRunyararo naGumiguru 2nd, rinova zuva rekuzvarwa raMahatma Gandhi, zvakare iro Zuva reNyika reRunyararo, iro rakakosha basa rinogona kuitika, saka Campaign Nonviolence uye nei zvakadaro yakakosha kwatiri kuti tive nemumwe munhu akazvipira kwazvo kupedza hondo pane yedu show nhasi, Kathy Kelly.
Tinotenda zvikuru amai vedu chiteshi, KWMR, kuna Kathy Kelly nekubatana nesu, kuna Matt Watrous nekunyora uye kugadzirisa iyo show, Annie Hewitt, kuna Bryan Farrell ku Kuring Nonviolence, uyo anogara achibatsira kugovana chiratidziro uye chiwane kumusoro uko. Uye kwamuri, vateereri vedu, ndinokutendai zvikuru. Uye kune wese munhu akabatsira kufunga nezve mazano uye mibvunzo yeiyo show, ndatenda zvikuru. Uye kusvikira nguva inotevera, tarisana.
Ichi chiitiko chine mimhanzi kubva DAF Zvinyorwa.
