Wolemba Independent Global News, democracynow.org, February 10, 2022
African Union ikudzudzula chiwonongeko ku Africa, kumene asilikali ankhondo adalanda mphamvu m'miyezi yapitayi ya 18 ku Mali, Chad, Guinea, Sudan ndipo, posachedwapa, mu Januwale, Burkina Faso. Ambiri adatsogozedwa ndi akuluakulu ophunzitsidwa ndi US monga gawo la gulu lankhondo laku US lomwe likukulirakulira mderali mothandizidwa ndi zigawenga, zomwe ndi mphamvu yatsopano yachifumu yomwe imawonjezera mbiri yautsamunda waku France, akutero Brittany Meché, pulofesa wothandizira pa Williams College. Kuukira kwina kwachitika ndi chikondwerero m'misewu, kuwonetsa kuwukira kwa zida kwakhala njira yomaliza kwa anthu omwe sakhutira ndi maboma osalabadira. "Pakati pa nkhondo yolimbana ndi zigawenga zomwe zimatsogozedwa ndi US komanso malingaliro a mayiko ambiri pa 'chitetezo,' iyi ndi nkhani yomwe imayang'ana, ngati si mwayi, njira zothetsera mavuto andale," akuwonjezera Samar Al-Bulushi, mkonzi wothandizira ku Africa. Ndi Dziko.
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Uku ndikuthamanga kumeneku. Koperani mwina sikukhala yomaliza.
AMY GOODMAN: Pa Ogasiti 18, 2020, asitikali ku Mali adagwetsa Purezidenti Ibrahim Boubacar Keïta, zomwe zidayambitsa zipolowe ku Africa. Epulo watha, khonsolo yankhondo ku Chad idalanda mphamvu pambuyo pa imfa ya Purezidenti wakale wa Chad Idriss Déby. Kenako, pa Meyi 24, 2021, Mali adachitiranso nkhanza kwachiwiri mchaka chimodzi. Pa Seputembala 5, asitikali aku Guinea adalanda Purezidenti wa dzikolo ndikuthetsa boma la Guinea ndi malamulo ake. Kenako, pa Okutobala 25, asitikali aku Sudan adalanda mphamvu ndikuyika Prime Minister Abdalla Hamdok m'ndende yapanyumba, ndikumaliza kukankhira ku Sudan ku ulamuliro wamba. Ndipo pamapeto pake, milungu iwiri yapitayo, pa Januware 23, atsogoleri ankhondo aku Burkina Faso, motsogozedwa ndi mkulu wophunzitsidwa ndi US, adachotsa pulezidenti wa dzikolo, kuyimitsa malamulo oyendetsera dzikolo ndikuthetsa nyumba yamalamulo. Ndiko kulanda dziko kasanu ndi kamodzi m’maiko asanu a mu Afirika m’chaka chimodzi ndi theka chabe.
Kumapeto kwa sabata, bungwe la African Union linadzudzula zigawenga zomwe zachitika posachedwa. Uyu ndi Purezidenti waku Ghana Nana Akufo-Addo.
PRESIDENT NANA AKUFO-ADDO: Kuyambikanso kwa zigawenga m’chigawo chathu kukuphwanya mfundo za demokalase yathu ndipo zikuwopseza mtendere, chitetezo ndi bata ku West Africa.
AMY GOODMAN: African Union yayimitsa maiko anayi: Mali, Guinea, Sudan ndipo posachedwa, Burkina Faso. Zambiri mwa zigawenga zakhala zikutsogozedwa ndi asitikali omwe adaphunzitsidwa ku US, omwe aku US [Sic] Atsogoleri. The Intercept posachedwapa inanena Akuluakulu ophunzitsidwa ndi US ayesa kulanda zosachepera zisanu ndi zinayi, ndipo apambana osachepera asanu ndi atatu, kudutsa mayiko asanu a Kumadzulo kwa Africa kuyambira 2008, kuphatikizapo Burkina Faso katatu; Guinea, Mali katatu; Mauritania ndi Gambia.
Kuti tilankhule zambiri za chiwembuchi mu Africa monse, tabwera ndi alendo awiri. Samar Al-Bulushi ndi anthropologist ku yunivesite ya California, Irvine, akuyang'ana kwambiri za apolisi, zankhondo komanso zomwe zimatchedwa nkhondo yachigawenga ku East Africa. Buku lake lomwe likubwerali lili ndi mutu Kupanga Nkhondo Monga Kupanga Padziko Lonse. Brittany Meché ndi pulofesa wothandizira wa maphunziro a zachilengedwe ku Williams College, komwe amayang'ana kwambiri mikangano ndi kusintha kwa chilengedwe ku West African Sahel.
Brittany, tiyambe ndi iwe, Pulofesa Meché. Ngati mungalankhule za dera lino la Africa ndi chifukwa chiyani mukukhulupirira kuti akukumana ndi zigawenga izi kapena kuyesa kulanda boma?
BRITTANY MECHÉ: Zikomo, Amy. Ndizosangalatsa kukhala pano.
Kotero, chimodzi mwa ndemanga zoyamba zomwe ndikufuna kupereka ndikuti nthawi zambiri zinthu zoterezi zikachitika, zimakhala zosavuta kuyika chithunzithunzi chosapeŵeka pazochitika zonsezi. Choncho, n’zosavuta kungonena kuti West Africa, kapena kontinenti ya ku Africa imalemba zazikulu, ndi malo chabe kumene kuukira kumachitika, kusiyana ndi kufunsa mafunso ovuta kwambiri okhudza zochitika zamkati komanso zakunja zomwe zimathandiza kuti zigawenga izi zitheke.
Chifukwa chake, malinga ndi zochitika zamkati, izi zitha kukhala zinthu ngati anthu omwe ataya chikhulupiriro m'maboma awo kuti ayankhe zofunikira, mtundu wakusayanjanitsika wamba komanso lingaliro loti maboma sangathe kulabadira madera, komanso mphamvu zakunja. . Chifukwa chake, takambirana pang'ono za njira zomwe olamulira ena mwa zigawenga izi, makamaka poganizira za Mali ndi Burkina Faso, adaphunzitsidwa ndi US, komanso nthawi zina France. Chifukwa chake, mabizinesi akunja otere mu gawo lachitetezo adaumitsa magawo ena aboma kuwononga utsogoleri wademokalase.
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: Ndipo, Pulofesa Meché, mudatchulanso France. Ambiri mwa mayikowa anali mbali ya ufumu wakale wa atsamunda a ku France ku Africa, ndipo dziko la France lachita mbali yaikulu m'zaka makumi angapo zapitazi ponena za asilikali awo ku Africa. Kodi mungalankhule za izi, pamene United States ikuyamba kukhala ndi mphamvu zowonjezereka ku Africa komanso pamene France ikubwerera kumbuyo, ponena za bata kapena kusakhazikika kwa maboma ambiriwa?
BRITTANY MECHÉ: Eya, ndikuganiza kuti ndizosatheka kumvetsetsa Sahel yamakono yaku Africa popanda kumvetsetsa zovuta zomwe dziko la France lidakumana nalo monga ulamuliro wakale wa atsamunda komanso ngati mphamvu yayikulu yazachuma m'maiko, makamaka yomwe imalimbikitsa chuma, kuchotsa zinthu ku West West. African Sahel, komanso pokhazikitsa ndondomeko, makamaka m'zaka khumi zapitazi, zomwe zikuyang'ana kwambiri pakulimbikitsa asilikali, kulimbikitsa apolisi, kulimbikitsa ntchito zolimbana ndi uchigawenga m'dera lonselo, ndi njira zomwe, kachiwiri, izi zimalimbitsa chitetezo.
Koma ndikuganizanso, makamaka kuganiza za chikoka cha US, kuti US, poyesa kupanga mtundu wa zisudzo zatsopano zankhondo yolimbana ndi zigawenga ku West African Sahel, zathandiziranso zina mwazoyipa zomwe ife. ndawona kudera lonselo. Ndipo kotero kuyanjana kwa onse omwe anali atsamunda omwe kale anali atsamunda komanso zomwe zafotokozedwa ndi omenyera ufulu wawo pansi ngati mtundu watsopano wa ufumu wa United States, ndikuganiza kuti zonsezi zikusokoneza dera, pansi pa mtundu wa zolinga za kupititsa patsogolo chitetezo. Koma zomwe taziwona zikungowonjezera kusakhazikika, kukulitsa kusatetezeka.
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: Ndipo ponena za kusakhazikika kumeneku m'derali, bwanji za nkhaniyi, mwachiwonekere, yomwe yachititsa chidwi kwambiri ku United States m'derali, za kuwonjezeka kwa zigawenga zachisilamu, kaya ndi al-Qaeda kapena ISIS, m'derali?
BRITTANY MECHÉ: Eya, kotero, ngakhale ngati maukonde a zigawenga padziko lonse akugwira ntchito ku West African Sahel, kotero al-Qaeda mu Islamic Maghreb komanso mphukira za ISIL, ndikuganiza kuti ndikofunikira kuganizira zachiwawa zomwe zikuchitika ku Sahel monga kwenikweni. mikangano mdera. Chifukwa chake, ngakhale amalowa m'maukonde ena apadziko lonse lapansi, amakhala mikangano yakumaloko, komwe madera akumaloko akumva kuti maboma onse amtunduwu sangathe kuyankha zosowa zawo komanso kukulitsa mpikisano paulamuliro. ndi njira zoyankhira, komanso mtundu wa kusagwirizana kwakukulu m'njira zomwe anthu mwina amawona kuwukira kwa zida, kutsutsa zida, monga njira imodzi yomwe yatsala kuti ipange zonena, kupanga zonena pa maboma omwe amawona kuti palibe kwenikweni komanso osalabadira.
AMY GOODMAN: Pulofesa Meché, mu kamphindi tikufuna kukufunsani za mayiko ena, koma ndimafuna kuti ndipite kwa pulofesa Samar Al-Bulushi, katswiri wa chikhalidwe cha anthu ku yunivesite ya California, Irvine, yemwe amayang'ana kwambiri za apolisi, zankhondo ndi zomwe zimatchedwa nkhondo. mantha ku East Africa, wothandizira mkonzi wofalitsa Africa Ndi Dziko ndi mnzake ku Quincy Institute. Ngati mungatipatse chithunzi chonse cha derali pankhani ya zankhondo, makamaka kukhudzidwa kwa US pankhani yophunzitsa apolisi omwe akuchita nawo zigawengazi? Ndikutanthauza, ndizodabwitsa kwambiri. M'miyezi 18 yapitayi, tawona kuchuluka kwa zigawenga izi. M’zaka 20 zapitazi sitinaonepo chiwembu choterechi mu Africa monse mu nthawi imeneyi.
SAMAR AL-BULUSHI: Zikomo, Amy. Ndibwino kukhala nanu pawonetsero m'mawa uno.
Ndikuganiza kuti mukulondola: Tikufunika kufunsa za momwe dziko likukulirakulira komwe kwalimbikitsa asitikaliwa kuti achite izi. Pakati pa nkhondo yolimbana ndi zigawenga zomwe zimatsogozedwa ndi US komanso kukhazikitsidwa kwa mayiko ambiri padziko lonse lapansi, mawu oti, "chitetezo," iyi ndi nkhani yomwe imayang'ana, ngati si mwayi, mayankho ankhondo kumavuto andale. Ndikuganiza kuti pali chizolowezi m'manyuzipepala ambiri omwe amafotokoza za kuukira kwaposachedwa kuyika osewera akunja kunja kwa kusanthula, koma mukaganizira za kukula kwa gulu lankhondo la US ku Africa, lomwe limadziwikanso kuti AFRICOM, limakhala. zikuwonekeratu kuti kungakhale kulakwitsa kutanthauzira zomwe zikuchitika m'mayikowa ngati zotsatira za mikangano yandale yamkati yokha.
Kwa omvera omwe sadziwa, AFRICOM idakhazikitsidwa mchaka cha 2007. Tsopano ili ndi zida zankhondo pafupifupi 29 zodziwika bwino m'maboma 15 kudera lonselo. Ndipo maiko ambiri, monga mudanenera, omwe akumanapo ndi zigawenga kapena kuyesa kulanda boma ndi othandizana nawo akuluakulu a US pankhondo yolimbana ndi zigawenga, ndipo atsogoleri ambiri a zigawengazi adaphunzitsidwa ndi asitikali aku US.
Tsopano, kuphatikiza kwa maphunziro ndi thandizo lazachuma, komanso kuti ambiri mwa awa, mawu-osagwirizana, "maiko ogwirizana" amalola asitikali aku US kuti azigwira ntchito m'nthaka yawo, zikutanthauza kuti mayiko aku Africa atha kukulitsa kwambiri zomangira zachitetezo. Mwachitsanzo, ndalama zankhondo zogulira magalimoto apolisi okhala ndi zida, ma helikoputala oukira, ma drones ndi zoponya zakwera kwambiri. Ndipo pamene zankhondo za m'nthawi ya Cold War zidayika patsogolo dongosolo ndi bata, zankhondo zamasiku ano zimatanthauzidwa ndi kukonzekera nthawi zonse kunkhondo. Mpaka zaka 20 zapitazo, mayiko ochepa a ku Africa anali ndi adani akunja, koma nkhondo yolimbana ndi zigawenga yakhazikitsanso mawerengedwe am'madera okhudza chitetezo, ndipo zaka zophunzitsidwa ndi AFRICOM zatulutsa mbadwo watsopano wa ochita chitetezo omwe ali ndi malingaliro komanso okonzeka kumenya nkhondo. .
Ndipo titha kuganiza za njira zomwe izi zimasinthira mkati, sichoncho? Ngakhale ataphunzitsidwa kumenya nkhondo kunja, titha kutanthauzira zigawenga izi ngati - mukudziwa, ngati kutembenukira mkati mwa dongosolo lamtunduwu komanso malingaliro ankhondo. Chifukwa dziko la US ndi ogwirizana nawo amadalira kwambiri mayiko ambiriwa kuti achitepo kanthu pachitetezo ku kontinenti, ambiri mwa atsogoleriwa nthawi zambiri amatha kuphatikiza mphamvu zawo m'njira yomwe imapewa kufufuzidwa ndi kunja, osasiya kudzudzula.
Ndipo ndingapitenso patsogolo kunena kuti mayiko omwe ndi abwenzi ngati Kenya, alowa nawo - ku Kenya, kulowa nawo pankhondo yachigawenga kwathandizira kwambiri kukulitsa mbiri yake. Zikuwoneka ngati zotsutsana, koma Kenya yatha kudziyika ngati, mawu-unquote, "mtsogoleri" pankhondo yolimbana ndi zigawenga ku East Africa. Ndipo mwanjira ina, kulimbikitsa projekiti yolimbana ndi uchigawenga sikungokhudza kupeza thandizo lakunja, komanso momwe mayiko aku Africa angawonetsere kufunika kwawo ngati osewera padziko lonse lapansi masiku ano.
Mfundo yomaliza yomwe ndikufuna kunena ndikuti ndikuganiza kuti ndizofunikira kwambiri kuti tisachepetse zochitikazi chifukwa cha mapangidwe achifumu, chifukwa zochitika za dziko ndi zigawo ndizofunikira kwambiri ndipo zimatipangitsa chidwi, makamaka ku Sudan. , kumene mayiko a Gulf angakhale ndi mphamvu zambiri kuposa United States. Chifukwa chake tikungofunika kuzindikira zoopsa zomwe zimabwera, ndikusanthula kokulirapo, monga momwe ndikukupatsirani pano, tikamalankhula nthawi zambiri zandale zosiyanasiyana.
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: Ndipo, Pulofesa Bulushi, ponena za - mudatchulapo kuchuluka kwa thandizo lankhondo lomwe lachokera ku United States kupita kumayiko awa. Ena mwa mayikowa ndi ena mwa mayiko osauka kwambiri padziko lapansi. Chifukwa chake, mutha kuyankhula za momwe zimakhudzira pomanga dziko komanso kutengera gawo lalikulu lomwe asitikali amachita m'maikowa, ngakhale ngati gwero la ntchito kapena ndalama kumagulu a anthu omwe ali mbali ya kapena kugwirizana ndi asilikali?
SAMAR AL-BULUSHI: Eya, ndi funso labwino kwambiri. Ndipo ndikuganiza kuti ndikofunikira kukumbukira pano kuti chithandizo chomwe chaperekedwa ku kontinenti sichimangokhudza magulu ankhondo komanso magulu ankhondo. Ndipo zomwe tikuwona pamene tiyamba kuyang'anitsitsa kwambiri ndikuti njira yotetezedwa ndi chitetezo ndi njira yankhondo ku mavuto onse a chikhalidwe ndi ndale zakhala zikugwira bwino ntchito zambiri zamakampani onse opereka ndalama ku Africa. Tsopano, izi zikutanthauza kuti zimakhala zovuta kwambiri kwa bungwe lachitukuko, mwachitsanzo, kupeza thandizo kwa china chirichonse osati chinachake chokhudzana ndi chitetezo. Ndipo pakhala zolembedwa m'zaka zaposachedwa zomwe zikuwonetsa zotsatira za mtundu uwu wautsamunda wa gawo lothandizira pa anthu kudera lonselo, m'lingaliro lakuti satha kupeza ndalama zothandizira zinthu zomwe zikufunika kwambiri, mukudziwa, kaya ndizovuta. chisamaliro chaumoyo, kaya ndi maphunziro, ndi mtundu umenewo wa chinthu.
Tsopano, ndikufuna kunena pano kuti pankhani ya Somalia, tikutha kuona kuti alipo - bungwe la African Union latumiza gulu lankhondo ku Somalia chifukwa cha kulowererapo kwa Ethiopia, kulowererapo kwa Ethiopia ku Somalia mu 2006. Ndipo tikhoza kuyamba kuona - ngati titsatira ndalama zomwe zakhala zikugwiritsidwa ntchito pothandizira ntchito yamtendere ku Somalia, tikuwona momwe mayiko ambiri aku Africa akudalira kwambiri ndalama zankhondo. Kuphatikiza pa ndalama zomwe zimabwera mwachindunji ku maboma awo ankhondo kuti aphunzitse, akudalira kwambiri - asitikali awo amadalira kwambiri ndalama zochokera ku mabungwe ngati European Union, mwachitsanzo, kulipira malipiro awo. Ndipo chomwe chili chochititsa chidwi apa ndikuti asitikali oteteza mtendere ku Somalia amalandira malipiro omwe nthawi zambiri amakhala mpaka 10 zomwe amapeza kumayiko awo akangokhala, mukudziwa, akutumizidwa kunyumba kwawo. Ndipo kotero ife tikhoza kuyamba kuona kuti angati mwa mayikowa - ndipo ku Somalia, ndi Burundi, Djibouti, Uganda, Kenya ndi Ethiopia - omwe adalira kwambiri chuma cha ndale chomwe chimapangidwa ndi nkhondo. Kulondola? Tikuwona mtundu womwe ukubwera wantchito yankhondo yosamukira komwe yakhala ndi zotsatira zoteteza ndi kuthetsa kuwunika kwa anthu ndi udindo wawo maboma ngati United States - sichoncho? - zomwe zikadakhala kuti zikutumiza asitikali ake kumalo akutsogolo.
AMY GOODMAN: Pulofesa Brittany Meché, ndimadabwa - ndinu katswiri ku Sahel, ndipo tikuwonetsa mapu a dera la Sahel ku Africa. Ngati mutha kuyankhula za kufunikira kwake, ndiyeno kuyang'ana kwambiri ku Burkina Faso? Ndikutanthauza, zoona kumeneko, inu, mu 2013, munakumana ndi asilikali apadera a US omwe anali kuphunzitsa asilikali ku Burkina Faso. Izi ndi zaposachedwa kwambiri pachiwembu chomwe mtsogoleri wachiwembu adaphunzitsidwa ndi US, US idathira ndalama zoposera biliyoni zomwe zimatchedwa thandizo lachitetezo. Kodi mungalankhule za momwe zinthu zilili kumeneko ndi zomwe mwapeza polankhula ndi magulu awa?
BRITTANY MECHÉ: Zedi. Chifukwa chake, ndikufuna kupereka ndemanga yazambiri za Sahel, yomwe nthawi zambiri imalembedwa ngati gawo losauka kwambiri padziko lapansi koma idachita mbali yofunika kwambiri m'mbiri yapadziko lonse lapansi, kuganiza mozama. m'zaka za m'ma 20 ndi kuwonekera kwa thandizo lothandizira padziko lonse lapansi, komanso akupitiriza kugwira ntchito yofunika kwambiri monga gawo lalikulu la uranium, komanso kukhala ngati chandamale cha ntchito zankhondo zomwe zikuchitika.
Koma kuti ndilankhulenso pang'ono za Burkina Faso, ndikuganiza kuti ndizosangalatsa kwambiri kubwereranso mu 2014, pomwe mtsogoleri wa nthawiyo a Blaise Compaoré adachotsedwa pachiwonetsero chodziwika bwino pomwe amayesa kuwonjezera ulamuliro wake polembanso Constitution. Ndipo nthawi imeneyo inali nthawi yanthawi yotheka, mphindi yamalingaliro osintha zomwe Burkina Faso ingakhale pambuyo pa kutha kwa ulamuliro wa zaka 27 wa Compaoré.
Chifukwa chake, mu 2015, ndidakumana ndi gulu lankhondo lapadera la US lomwe likuchita maphunziro othana ndi uchigawenga komanso chitetezo mdziko muno. Ndipo ndidafunsa molunjika ngati akuganiza kuti, potengera mphindi ino yakusintha kwademokalase, ngati mitundu iyi yandalama mu gawo lachitetezo ingasokoneze ndondomekoyi ya demokalase. Ndipo anandipatsa chitsimikizo chamtundu uliwonse kuti zina mwa zomwe asilikali a US anali ku Sahel kuchita ndi kuphunzitsa asilikali a chitetezo. Ndipo ndikuganiza, poyang'ana mmbuyo pa kuyankhulana kuja ndikuwona zomwe zachitika pambuyo pake, zoyeserera zomwe zidachitika pasanathe chaka chimodzi nditachita nawo zoyankhulanazo ndipo tsopano kupambana kopambana komwe kwachitika, ndikuganiza kuti ili ndi funso lochepa lokhudza ukatswiri. ndi funso la zomwe zimachitika pamene kupanga nkhondo kudzakhala kupanga dziko lapansi, kutenga mutu wa buku la Samar, koma mukamaumitsa gawo linalake la boma, kusokoneza mbali zina za dzikolo, kubwezeretsa ndalama kutali ndi zinthu monga Unduna wa Zaulimi, Unduna wa Zaumoyo, ku Unduna wa Zachitetezo. Ndizosadabwitsa kuti mtundu wa munthu wamphamvu mu yunifolomu umakhala mtundu wa zotsatira zamtundu woterewu.
Ndikufunanso kutchula ena mwa malipoti omwe takhala tikuwawona okhudza anthu akukondwerera zigawenga zomwe zachitika. Chifukwa chake, tidaziwona ku Burkina Faso, ku Mali. Tinaziwonanso ku Guinea. Ndipo sindikufuna izi - ndikanapereka izi osati ngati malingaliro odana ndi demokalase omwe amadzetsa madera awa, koma, lingaliro lamtunduwu ngati maboma a anthu wamba sanathe kuyankha madandaulo. wa madera, ndiye mtsogoleri, mtundu wa mtsogoleri wamphamvu, yemwe amati, "Ndidzakuteteza," amakhala mtundu wa yankho lokongola. Koma ndimatha kunena kuti pali mwambo wokhazikika, ku Sahel konse koma ku Burkina Faso makamaka, wosintha zinthu, wamalingaliro osintha zinthu, wofuna kukhala ndi moyo wabwino wandale, kuti ukhale ndi moyo wabwino wamagulu ndi anthu. Ndipo kotero, ndikuganiza ndi zomwe ndikuyembekeza, kuti kulanda kumeneku sikusokoneza, komanso kuti pali kubwerera ku chinachake chofanana ndi ulamuliro wademokalase m'dzikolo.
AMY GOODMAN: Ndikufuna kukuthokozani nonse chifukwa chokhala nafe. Ndi zokambirana zomwe tipitiliza kukhala nazo. Brittany Meché ndi pulofesa ku Williams College, ndipo Samar Al-Bulushi ndi pulofesa ku yunivesite ya California, Irvine.
Kenako, tikupita ku Minneapolis, komwe ochita ziwonetsero adapita m'misewu kuyambira Lachitatu lapitalo, apolisi atawombera Amir Locke wazaka 22. Anali atagona pa sofa pamene ankachita kuukira mosagogoda m’mamawa. Makolo ake amanena kuti anaphedwa. Ochita ziwonetsero ati apolisi akuyesera kubisa zomwe zidachitikadi. Khalani nafe.
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AMY GOODMAN: "Mphamvu, Kulimba Mtima & Nzeru" lolemba India.Arie. Lachisanu, wopambana Mphotho ya Grammy nthawi zinayi adalumikizana ndi ojambula ena omwe adatulutsa nyimbo zawo ku Spotify kutsutsa malingaliro atsankho omwe adanenedwa ndi podcaster Joe Rogan, komanso kukweza kwa Rogan zabodza za COVID-19. Arie adayika kanema wa Rogan akunena mawu a N-nthawi zosatha.
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